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Mobius

Old Debate: "Special" Zombies

"Special" Zombies Poll   57 members have voted

  1. 1. Does NMRiH need unique zombies (beyond Runners/Walkers/Crawlers)?

    • No, I prefer classic zombies.
      38
    • Yes, NMRiH needs more varieties of zombies (aka the "spice of life")
      14
    • Yes, but only in the role of a map's boss.
      5

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59 posts in this topic

I touched on this topic briefly in the poll discussing whether people though burning zombies should play a role in NMRiH, almost as a sub-type of zombie (similar to a crawler, who only crawls because you've injured its legs/spine). Of course in that poll the point was made that burning zombies died after a time.

So now let's discuss this more in-depth. Way back when some members suggested, after playing too much Resident Evil no doubt, that NMRiH should have more than just Runner and Shambler zombies. A thread was started to suggest new types of zombies, not the least of which included ones that:

  • Were able to spew out their own stomach acid (short ranged attack).
  • Were impaled with sharp objects (i.e. porcupine effect).
  • Were radioactive or covered in toxic chemicals.
  • Were covered in gasoline, and when shot they ignited.
  • Were explosive (due to methane gas...I suppose).
  • Were super strong/tough.
  • Were wearing bullet-proof helmets and vests (military/riot).

When some people argued against these varients, it was suggested perhaps these zombies could be unique (i.e. one per map). This was hailed as a case of "boss syndrome", something else people didn't want. Of course we all know this is something that can now be found in Left4Dead. So my question is, has this opinion changed, or do you guys still prefer the more classic zombie?

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I voted no, but I'm not against something "believable." Running/crawling zombies are believable, as is a zombie that has kevlar and stuff on (soldiers can get turned into zombies as well). On the other hand, a zombie would not blow up from methane gas, or be able to spew vomit at people :/ Stomach acid isn't that threatening either.

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I voted no, but I'm not against something "believable." Running/crawling zombies are believable, as is a zombie that has kevlar and stuff on (soldiers can get turned into zombies as well). On the other hand, a zombie would not blow up from methane gas, or be able to spew vomit at people :/ Stomach acid isn't that threatening either.

Exactly! :rolleyes:

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I'm in for Zombiest that: are impaled with sharp objects (zombies are stupid, they fall ie on a fence pole), tough (like some normal humans are stronger then other humans) are wearing bullet-proof helmets and vests.

Other then that, big NO.

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I agree with Copet on this one. Also, I think that the stronger zombies like Iniquity is talking about isn't a bad idea either...well for fast zombies because the decayed ones would just have all that muscle decaying. If there were a runner body builder zombie that would be a difficult zombie to beat, and that would be cool if he could somehow use his strength to get the better of the survivors like throwing objects, or charging really fast, or something...

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We should have something in the vein of Writhers, in Necrosis.

Writhers are individuals in the stage of infection directly after that of Screamers, when a man's consciousness is completely repressed and nothing remains but hunger. Necrosis has, by now, peeled apart most of their skin... thus placing them on the same ground physically as Infected. Writhers are named for the rapid convulsions they experience, courtesy of their nervous system being attacked by Actum Excessum. This behavior has earned them the semi-humorous nickname "Jacob", a nod to the old psychological horror film, that doesn't seem so much a work of fiction anymore. While their sentience is completely gone, Writhers still retain some remnants of their former intelligence. Somewhat similar to that of a lower primate. This manifests itself in a higher aptitude for tactical thinking and maneuver. Nothing serious, just the occasion where rather than beating their fists at a closed door they'll go around and enter through the basement.

Rapidly shaking things are just scary. They always will be, they're something inherently and primally foreboding about them.

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I'm up for anything believable like everyone else was saying. A super tough body builder maybe, a fat guy, a zombie with the kevlar and maybe helmet. That's all cool, but I've always hated puking zombies and stuff like that. Even a radioactive zombie seems a bit too rare to include.

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I'm going along yes but as long as it is "believable".

But I'd like to suggest four plausible roles that some zombies could undertake:

Screamer - Pretty basic Role, Screamers act as beacons for the Zombies attracting Shamblers and maybe runners to their location once it spots a survivor. when it spots a survivor they become motionless and only attack when a player comes into close proximity.

Kamikazi - Is plausible as a boss or a "Special" enemy to appear once at random in a horde. Kamikazi's were an attempt by Infectee's to try and cause maximum damage to the Zombies by becoming Infected Bombs. Some would run out into a street attracting the undead and detonating their explosive payload others stay behind and let the infection get them in the fear of dying. These ignorant souls let their bodies roam as deadly explosive wielding zombies, that when shot explode in a fiery blaze. They would act as both an aid in large hordes and serious threat in Barricades and Close quarters.

Berserker's - Not in the sense that these beings are very strong and resilient to bullets or weapons, quite the opposite in fact. Berserker's are basically smarter shamblers that wield various melee weapons, much like that of an early primate using clubs to beat their oppenants down. Berserker's would be tough in the way that they can cause alot of damage depending on the weapon they are equipped with. They can also function as a quick source to get a powerful weapon off them like a Zombie wielding a fire axe!

Brain or "Bub" - Ala from Day of the Dead, probably best as a type of boss Zombie at the end map like Outpost 31 or something. Brain's are smarter than Berserkers (would be rarer too) in the fact that they can operate firearms with limited effectiveness. Such as Bub shooting the Major in the shoulder with a 1911 in Day of the Dead. Brain would be a final boss type enemy at a map as the a Zombie that can shoot a gun would be terrifying to some people

I'm probably going to get flamed for the Berserker and Brain idea but I think the other too are plausible in some situations.

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Also in Land of the Dead movie, zombies were quite genious because they had ability pick up weapon and shoot (from hip) and that boss zombie (black guy in that blue suit) in LotD ordered those other zombies by attacking wall or something else.. Those were the most wise zombies I've seen.

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I voted yes, as in military zombies, that they have body armor and things like that.

I dislike the idea haveing a super strong or acid spewing zombies (ala RE).

Also, firemen who became zombies can endure fires, but not for long. That's is my kinda idea of how zombies can resist fires.

Other than that, we shouldn't have any "super uber 2k" zombies.

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Oh my god.. someone suggested a weapon firing zombie.

That's completely rediculous.

It's been done before, kind of, in "They Hunger". That is, if you consider those guys all to have been zombies and not "undead". Still, I never liked the idea of my zombies getting smart enough to use weapons, or even throwing objects.

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boss zombies does sound kewl bt then it takes away the realism unless they were taking steriods or somthing when they are bitten

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Honestly, we're already getting L4D with boss zombies, I'd like to have this, at least, not have it.

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I'd like this to be a simulation of what would happen were my city to be overrun by zombies, and having anything too "out there" like a boss would be kinda silly.

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the only real reason the boss infected are in l4d, is because it would only be 4 players and that wouldnt bee very fun.

and i voted clasic all the way.

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I wouldn't mind vomiters and armored zombies, so long as they're perhaps 1/10 the full amount, and are otherwise just normal zombies with added features. Everything else just seems too out there, and would feel too much like Zombie Master. Besides, smart-bomb zombies are annoying.

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I know we've all heard the idea of the acid puking zombie, and it made me think pof something that I don't think has been talked about in NMRiH. Why not have the fast zombies(runners) puke up blood onto their victims (like in 28 days/weeks later and Survival Crises:Z)? It would add another means of infection, and it wouldn't make any "Boss" type zombies it would just add to the runners abilities to infect and attack.

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This would really detract from gameplay. In a SURVIVAL horror game, where the goal is to stay alive as long as possible, making things too hard would ruin the fun. Now maybe its just me, but it really takes away from the immersion of a game if I'm dying every two minutes and respawning in the same place with the same weapons fighting my way through the same undead horde trying to get back to where I was before I died.

Edited by booze

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This would really detract from gameplay. In a SURVIVAL horror game, where the goal is to stay alive as long as possible, making things too hard would ruin the fun. Now maybe its just me, but it really takes away from the immersion of a game if I'm dying every two minutes and respawning in the same place with the same weapons fighting my way through the same undead horde trying to get back to where I was before I died.

I don't understand. Because NMRiH is a survival horror game it has to be easy?

Have you ever played any RE games besides RE4? Or do you even know what RE stands for :P ? Also, you only get one life in NMRiH, theres no respawning...atleast in the survival mode, so it may end up making the rounds a little shorter, of course it all depends on the players' teamwork and skill.

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In the old forum, I once made a thread about unique zombies, and much fruit came out of it. The ideas here seem basically the same, but there are many ideas that went missing, so I'll revive them.

Here's my opinion:

- More resilient zombies such as zombie soldiers and SWATs makes alot of sense, and the fact that they are harder to die due to their kevlar armor and helmets, combat gear makes a whole lot of sense too. One thing about the current SWAT officer model that I would like to highlight is that he has no armor, so his zombie version is at risk of being simply another regular Shambler. I would like to propose an alternative SWAT officer NPC with a helmet. The living allied NPC would also be harder to kill (By another Human), while the zombie enemy would be a bane to many players due to their helmet, which is highly effective at deflecting bullets. The national guard zombies would probably have the same features.

- Stronger zombies can be implemented, but somehow the artists and modelers would have to make him stand out. I would suggest making them topless or wearing singlets to reveal their bulging or well-toned muscles. Soldiers in training uniform (The very standard army shirt, pants and boots) can work too- They can be explained as recruits or soldiers who are off duty in a barracks who were successfully killed and infected. Their distinctive abilities could include heavier damages, better 'grip' on players, and slightly harder to kill.

- Fire-resistant zombies in the form of Firemen and Biogear scientists makes plenty of sense as well... But they should be alot more rarer... There are less Firemen and scientists in Biogear than soldiers anyway. Their strength and resilience should be roughly equal to other shamblers and runners with the exception of resilience against fire, chemicals such as acid, toxins and radiation.

- The way I see it, acid-puking zombies should not be implemented. For one thing, Humans, even when running at the most primitive level, would not have the capacity to voluntarily puke, making it impossible for zombies to do so since common theory suggests that they are running at a primitive level in the brain, albeit with a different diet and aggression level.

- There should not be 'boss' zombies. The above mentioned zombies are not bosses, just harder-to-overcome zombies. Plus, every map should have more than one of each.

- I would like to suggest zombies that makes use of our mind as a weapon against our selves- Zombies that uses fear against us. Such zombies would have grotesque looks, makes frightening noises, and normally operates in the darkness. For example, we can have a runner zombie who had risen in the middle of an autopsy, so its chest cavity and stomach was opened up, revealing the organs inside. As a result of damage to its vocal cord and mouth, it would make a frightening noise consisting of moans and inhuman gurgles. The shuffle of its feet would have a wet sound of blood to it... Now imagine that coming at you in total darkness save your flashlight, screaming away immediately after it spots you as it sprints at you. The scream itself would be enough to make you jump if it attacks from behind.

For the effect (A watered-down version, I know 'I am legend' is not the best thriller), imagine yourself as Robert Neville as he ventures through the dark corridors of a New York city building when he was searching for Sam (Samantha), his dog and only companion. Just the absence and anticipation for a frightening creature is enough to test the bravery of even the best player.

This zombie would however lose its shock and fear factor if it it out in the open, or in daylight/heavily lighted areas.

- 'Head-bobbers'. I remember suggesting a class of zombies that is very simple, yet effective. Basically, this form of zombies have a neck that is badly broken, but the head is still intact. This results in a head that moves frequently around as its neck can no longer support it. It would make the head tough to shoot. The head could be anywhere between resting on one of its shoulders to being resting on its chest or back. May have a shock and fear factor added to it if presented in the dark or foreboding area.

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I don't understand. Because NMRiH is a survival horror game it has to be easy?

Have you ever played any RE games besides RE4? Or do you even know what RE stands for :P ? Also, you only get one life in NMRiH, theres no respawning...atleast in the survival mode, so it may end up making the rounds a little shorter, of course it all depends on the players' teamwork and skill.

No, but it has to allow you to survive. If there are special flaming, acid spitting, exploding, etc zombies on top of the endless amount of regular zombies, you would never make it to the end of a map without respawns. Think of it as a cooperative RE singleplayer game, are you going to want to die every ten seconds because another zombie ridiculously spit infectious acid on you, exploded, set you on fire, and then gang raped you with a platoon of elephant paratroopers? It doesn't have to be "easy", it just has to give you a reason to not suicide for extra ammo. I hope you're kidding about no respawns, if that is the case it better be easy. I can't even begin to imagine how many people would be the last one alive and just sit in a barricaded room for the whole round making everyone wait on him. I'd prefer it to be challenging, but you have to be realistic about this. As much as we'd all like to dream about how the game will play, ninety percent of the players are going to be the "LoLz inernets" type, and these people aren't known for their cooperative teamwork skills.

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Acid-puking is just a ridiculous idea, no matter the range. Stomach acid isn't going to eat away your face or do any real damage at all unless you let it sit there for a really long time.

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As much as we'd all like to dream about how the game will play, ninety percent of the players are going to be the "LoLz inernets" type, and these people aren't known for their cooperative teamwork skills.

Thats exactly the reason i dont want this mod to be popular, and was also the reason i didnt want INS to get popular either, but it did, and it completely ruined it.

I would prefer there wouldn't be any respawning, unless it could be done by taking control of a random npc in the map. Not being able to respawn would make people alot more cautious, just like it should be. If you could just respawn endlessly everyone would just run around trying to kill zombies, respawning and then doing it again. The mod should be tough and challenging, or else it will really just turn into "hay lets shoot sum zombais guise!!!"

Having "swat zombies" with body armor, or other believable stuff like that, would be fine with me, but no exploding boss zombies.

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